Decolonizing Development: How the Pit Vidura Team is Putting Theory into Action

On a podcast hosted by Dr. Jay Graham, a Berkeley public health professor, we discuss Pit Vidura’s commitment to decolonizing development and what it means to put this into practice. Dr. Jay Graham invited Nicholas Kuria(Pit Vidura’s General Manager) and Dr. Rachel Sklar (Pit Vidura Founder and current Board Member) to discuss Pit Vidura’s philosophy on leadership, ensuring local empowerment of staff and community partners, and practical challenges that have arisen in doing that. They also discuss reframing the role of western academics and researchers as supporters of locally-led research projects and enterprises.

Jay Graham, Host:

Hello, I am really excited to have a conversation this week with Nicholas and Rachel, who operate Pit Vidura, which is a wastewater company based in Kigali, Rwanda. So I think you will get a lot out of this. It’s a really interesting discussion about power dynamics and how they are changing.

Rachel Sklar:

So Pit Vidura is a waste logistics company. Well, it’s a social enterprise that provides sanitation services to low-income households in urban areas, mostly in informal urban areas otherwise known as slums. In these places, they have no sewers and the households there use pit latrines and septic tanks. When they fill, they need to be emptied. But in many poor neighborhoods, people can’t afford to hire someone to come out with a truck and excavate the waste. So they do it themselves, or they hire someone in the community, just to do it by hand and then dump it in the environment.

So what Pit Vidura does is — it offers a safe and affordable alternative to that practice, which is removing the waste hygienically and then taking it to the dumping facility in a way that is low-cost that people in the slums can afford.

So I came to East Africa, originally, in 2013, on an assignment from a company that was turning human waste into solid fuel. And there, one of their gaps was that there weren’t getting enough human waste to really reach the industrial scale of fuel production. And that’s because, in a lot of East African cities, there is no sewer system. So waste, well, there may be a sewer system, but in a lot of these cities, the amount of waste that’s getting to the treatment plant or the disposal site is, you know, low compared to the population because a lot of people can’t afford formal sanitation services.

So I kind of went on an assignment to figure out how to get the waste out of communities and to this treatment plant where it could be turned into fuel. And so, you know, as part of my research, I figured out that a lot of the waste was getting trapped in slums and informal settlements because people couldn’t afford to hire those trucks. And yeah, so what we ended up doing was — we created a service specifically geared for these informal settlements to get the waste out and to the treatment plant. And that was kind of how Pit Vidura started. And we started by working directly with the workers, who were doing that dirty work, who were excavating the waste by hand and dumping it into the environment. And we’ve sort of trained them and we equipped them with tools and PPE’s and a steady stream of jobs, to make, you know, the work safe for them safe for the community, and also to provide feedstock for the waste to fuel plant. That’s how it all started.

Nicholas Kuria:

Ok, Thank you very much! My names are Nicholas Kuria. I am a trained vehicle mechanic. I am from Kenya. I am currently leading the operation of Pit Vidura, here in Kigali. So I ended up in sanitation through Pit Vidura’s parent company, which Rachel also talked about called Pivot, which was a resource recovery company transforming human waste into reusable fuel. This is also the company that I met Rachel. We worked both at Pivot. So initially, my assignment at that company was doing mechanic work and driving but the company some assistance in collecting sludge, doing greenhouse experiments, solar drying, greenhouse experiment, taking samples, and processing them in the laboratory. So they needed somebody to assist them in those work. And that’s why I got interested and I got that chance. So we did that. Although the company did not last long in Kenya, we did some assembling and testing of the equipment that they have already purchased before they move to Kigali. So when the company was moving, was relocating to Kigali, I was part of the team that relocated there, here, where we are now. And I worked in maintenance managing the maintenance of the plant maintenance, machine operations. So, at that time when we, when we constructed the plant here in Kigali, Pit Vidura was sourcing the sludge from the community and bringing it to the plant for processing. So, initially, as I was working on plant maintenance, I used to also be part of the team which was doing some work on the pumping technologies in Pit Vidura. We also worked with Rachel there. Eventually, that company also lasted about two to three years or so. and also it closed up its operation. So I moved on, but later in 2018–2019, I joined Pit Vidura in the management. Now working again with Rachel and here I am managing Pit Vidura operations in Kigali.

Jay Graham:

So, I am curious to hear how you all have begun to change, given the pandemic, and then some of the things that are happening in terms of really trying to remove kind of the history or reduce kind of the influence of colonialism in global health. I am curious to hear how you all begun to change the structure of Pit Vidura and empower local leadership

Rachel Sklar:

I can start again. We can go back and forth. So I feel like it’s not so much about empowering local leadership as it is about transitioning the existing power structures. And what I mean is, well, like for me, I guess, I always felt uncomfortable about supervising colleagues who are, you know, much more experienced than me, who obviously know so much more about the cultural context and the community than I did. I mean all the work that Pit Vidura has done to build relationships in the community, to build relationships with these informal waste workers, and to really form a presence in the community and a trusted presence in the community. All that heavy lifting has been done by obviously by my East African colleagues. And you know, as for what I can bring to the table, from my skills, I would say it’s mostly research and fundraising. So given that, I think that you know for the company to continue its mission, for the organization to continue its mission, for the longevity of its mission, it makes the most sense you know for someone like me to kind of step aside and let my East African colleagues do the work. And I would say, I have seen so many well-meaning westerners, western influencers, and western-funded projects, you know, start things and meddle in East African business, and politics and ultimately get stonewalled by African government or, you know, other parts of the ecosystem too. And this makes sense to me, you know, after all the history of colonialism on the continent, why would an East African government trust or engage with westerners trying to tell them what to do and how to run their country and how to make life for their own communities better? So yeah, I guess for me, it felt like a sort of natural evolution of the organization. And yeah, Nicholas was the best person to take over after I sort of exhausted my, you know, connections to foundations and fundraising entities to raise a seed round for the organization. But after that, we started thinking really long-term about it. How to make this a sustainable thing? And that was clearly to transition to the local team.

Nicholas Kuria:

In terms of structuring or local empowerment, I think it’s a good thing seeing the potential and growing the potential of local leadership. In most of the companies, you will find, you’ll find the management or the people who own, the people who are founders of the company are still the people who are making the decisions where the company is based in the community. So I think empowering the local team, giving them, first showing them the problem they are solving, the problem that exists, and the problem that needs to be solved. And for them understanding that. And also letting them make decisions about solving those problems. I think, think it is a good move.

When Pit Vidura and the work we do in the community, we saw it is good. Like we employed. We have this team of emptiers, who are former manual emptiers, who understand the community very well. And we also have this management, we have these guys who are emptiers, who also, who have grown to supervision role, supervising other people, and we have this other team which is for local who understand the problem in the local. So empowering them and assisting them in making the decisions which are affecting or which are solving the problem in their community, I think, I can’t think any, I can not find I think a good word to put it. I think it is the best move for the company.

Jay Graham:

That’s great! I have one follow-up question to that Nicholas, which is: If there was a student, let’s say there was a student, who is studying global health in the United States, and they said, “Oh, I want to come and do global health in Kigali.” What would be your advice to them in terms of a role that they can play? Is there a role for western global health researchers? What are the things that you think need to sort of stop? And what are the things that maybe can continue to go forward and be actually helpful?

Nicholas Kuria:

Yeah, I think there’s. There’s a lot, there’s a lot here. And one thing is that there is a lot which has not been shared. There is a lot of things, which I mean there are a lot of learning, here, which has not been shared with the world. As you know, we also have a research and development department where we try to, we try to, share our learnings. We try to share the challenges we have with other organizations. And I think, I think somebody, I think somebody coming from Western Universities, like USA, there is a lot to share with the world of what is happening and the experiences of the sanitation and the health sector at large.

Jay Graham:

That’s great. Rachel, do you have some thoughts on that question?

Rachel Sklar:

Yeah, I feel like it is a question that I have been getting a lot, you know, what is our role as westerners in global health, you know, considering this sort of this decolonization agenda. And you know, I thought a lot about this, and at the moment, I think it should be really to focus on toppling these power structures and then figure out what our role is. It is probably a supporting role, you know, a second fit all, not the lead decision maker and big development project.

Yeah, so you know, really listening to what people like Nicholas say the need. And you know, I can certainly attest to the difficulty of like unlearning the patterns of wanting to take charge and design research projects and make decisions and form partnerships. But you know, I have Nicholas to remind me that he is sort of, you know, in charge and he will let me know what they need to carry on this mission.

Jay Graham:

That’s really, yeah, I really appreciated both of those responses. I think this is a really, like, this is kind of where we have to make all these theories reality. and so I really like hearing sort of your thoughts and really what are the steps that we take.

What have been the biggest challenges to this sort of transitioning leadership? And how is the process going for you all?

Nicholas Kuria:

So, there are challenges. There are challenges in this in this transition, you know, this is not a common, this is not a common system, where you find the owner or the founder of the company is leaving active role in managing the company and having, having, or assigning local people to do or to make decisions on the moves that they are making on the company. This is not, this is not, this not a common system.

I think when we’re trying to figure out how we are going to work when Rachel was transitioning to an advisory role. We tried also to, we try to, consult some legal team, here in Kigali, about how the transition could be able to work. And most of them, they didn’t understand.

They were like, I think you guys, you guys want to, you are taking over the company of your boss. What do you make the what do you? why do you guys want to make this transition? Why don’t you stay the way, the way, you are? Even when we when we tried to pitch that idea to our board members at that time, most of them, they were not they were not buying the idea. They were like, Let’s keep the system. And I think, one of their fears, one of the fear, is that they seem not to I think, trust, that the vision of the company or the mission of the company is still going to continue as per how the founder of the company would have wished, you know. And that was the fear. But I think when we have people who already understand the problem the company is solving, I think afterward once they saw, like, we already understand the vision of the company, we already know what we want to achieve in our communities, they slowly started buy-in. In terms of funding and getting grants and funding, it is a big big challenge because foreign investors believe or trust that their money will be saved, and will be safe in the hand of a foreigner compared to local leadership. There is an organization in which we tried to acquire a capital investment, but it was a low-interest capital investment, but after they learned about the transition that we are going through they say I think they don’t feel their money is safe or they don’t think that we can be able to to pay.

They want, they would love the company, they would love the assurance that their money to be safe, have to be from foreigner other foreigners like our boss, who is from who is no who is a foreigner. If she is still making the decision, they were like they would trust that they money or we are going to pay that low-interest loan. So getting an investment, donors trusting the local leadership, and trusting that their investment or their money is going to be safe with local leadership is still a challenge a huge challenge even right now

Jay Graham:

Yeah, It sounds like there are a lot of obstacles for you all to move forward with this this agenda of transition. But yeah, good for you for moving this along.

Is there any advice you would give to other organizations trying to support local leadership or transition leadership to local individuals?

Rachel Sklar:

For now, just I am sort of making it my personal mission to advocate for the team, you know, to the funding agencies, to people I have connections with. You know, when they reach out with proposal calls and opportunities, I always forward them to Nicholas and let the funders know that my colleagues, not I, are very interested in applying. And I feel like it is a shame that I still have to keep playing this role. But you know, it is the system as it operates for now, and hopefully, with more time and more advocacy, the tide will shift. And, you know, the opportunities will fall more directly into Nicholas’ lap and other leaders like him. But yeah, I think the funding paradigm really needs to be changed because it’s just so much harder for, you know, Nicholas to access those resources than me. And, you know, maybe because I am better at writing in English and, you know, the funding sources are in, you know, from America and the UK, or maybe because I have connections to a lot of these people because I live in the Bay Area, I went to Berkeley, and I have the privilege of sort of passively networking with these people. But yeah, I guess my advice would be “ think about changing the funding structures and think about pushing the people who are doing the work in front of those funders and agencies”.

Nicholas Kuria:

So how the things are going, we are continuing, I think what we are doing is that we don’t want to we don’t want to work like we are proving a point. So we understand the problem in our communities, we are continuing to do our best to solve the problem in our communities. And we understand even the donors or the investors, once they see the work that we are doing, and the value that we are, and the impact that we are making to the communities, they will they will join our hand and support our work regardless whether the management is from the management is from the western western country. We feel confident with the team, here in Kigali. We are pushing forward with our goals. And we appreciate Rachel’s support because she has been doing the heavy lifting. She is the one who does grant writing and applications, try to fetch us some investors to support our work, looking for opportunities, for grant opportunities. So she she has been really really helpful, in terms of those. We also have research and development department and recently we published a peer review paper last year. We have given talks in big wash conferences, last year. And we’ll still continue doing so with the help of Rachel and other board members.

Jay Graham:

Yeah, I mean, it sounds like you all have figured out ways. You know, Rachel has some strings that can help support Pit Vidura but with the recognition that real leadership is happening in-country and that she is playing a supportive role.

But Rachel, it feels like you don’t feel like that’s enough. Like, you feel, it feels like you really want to extricate yourself, but it seems you also love the team and love this work. So do you see how you could, you know, continue to work with them and collaborate with them, but maybe in a small supportive role?

Rachel Sklar:

Certainly, I mean, I think like Nicholas just mentioned, you know, with regards to the research, I think that’s where people like me, western academics, can really help. You know, that’s our skill, that’s our training. Historically, there’s been way fewer way fewer entries into these international journals by authors in Africa. So I feel like, you know, my support there can really make a difference and help, you know, help young and emerging scientists sort of join the international scientific conversation. And then, of course, you know, when Nick needs me to review a grant application or something like that I am more than happy to do it. And, you know, because I have years of experience doing that type of thing. I think it makes sense for me to do it. Yeah, sure, we have a long way to go in terms of, you know, funders reaching out directly to organizations on the ground. And I do wish that I didn’t have to be the middleman for that. But I’m, you know, happy to do it for now. And like I said before, hopefully, we can start making some tangible changes in that way as a sector.

Jay Graham:

Great, well, We are now wrapping up. So I just want to give you both an opportunity to just share any final thoughts or things that crossed your mind and conversation that you didn’t get to talk about. So I will just open the floor to both of you to give some, you know, final thoughts.

Nicholas Kuria:

I think the advice which I can be able to give other organizations who are supporting, trying to support the local leadership is to make to support the local leadership without I think without giving the conditions, you know. The conditions have to be there, but I think some conditions have to be there, but I think trust the local leadership, people who understand the problem in the community, people who are doing better to solve the those problems. I think that’s that an advice — Trust the local leadership, trust the team, first understand the people understand the problem that they are solving, Impact on the community. I think I can be able to say not to fear to support to support the local leadership. And also, one thing which I saw very helpful is making connections. So you know, like, currently, the heavy lifting work that has been done by Rachel, for us here, in Kigali, we cannot be able to do because we don’t know where to get these donors, to fund for, to support our work. So, but the connection that Rachel has been connecting us with these donors and with these organizations, I think connecting this local leadership with that exposure, I think that can be very helpful. We are still learning we are still learning how to write these grants, how to approach donors, how to pitch to those investors and donors. But that exposure, I think, to the local team will will help the the local management in accomplishing their in accomplishing their goals.

So final thought is that we love the impact that we are doing in their community, offering safe sanitation services to even to hard to reach areas. So we first of all, we love what we are doing, and the community accepts our work, and it keeps us going. We know, we still, our company is still trying to to breakeven because of the the cost of serving these low-income is very high. It surpasses the the money that we are getting for the service. But we are trying hard, we are not giving up, we are trying hard, and we would love for the for the support, we would love to get the support on our project that we the project that we have like research and development or covering operating expenses so that we can continue. Because without us doing the work that we are doing, some of this sludge could end up in the hands of manual emptiers, which are going to empty and dump in the community, endangering the lives of vulnerable people in the communities and the environment. So we love what we are doing, we appreciate the support that we have been getting, and we encourage the, we encourage the , or we open our doors for those wellwishers who would like to support our work here in Kigali. They are most welcome.

Jay Graham:

Thank you

Rachel Sklar:

I, I agree with that. And I guess my last thought is, you know, despite working in the sector that as nominally valued capacity building, for a really long time now, I don’t see any power shifting. You know, I don’t see any big power shifts in the sector from western powers to the local communities. And I think, you know, we need to think tangibly about what that means not just talk about it. And I think, one tangible way to shift that power is through ownership, you know, like giving equity or company equity to employees, which is one thing we have been working on this year. And another way to tangibly shift the power structure, I think, is to let the community interact with the grant givers more directly or to create, you know, structures within these funding paradigms to help that happen.

Jay Graham:

That was awesome, you guys.

Rachel Sklar:

Thanks for having us, Jay.